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TOPIC: Water intake, Does Tea count and Coffee???

 
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December 7, 2012 1:08 AM
QUOTE:

"Only water is water" - Everyone who doesn't have an elementary-school-level understanding of chemistry.


Seriously! Honestly, it's shocking how many people have forgotten elementary level chemistry! I remember learning about molecules and solutions back in 6th grade. And amazing how people with obviously no science background feel qualified to give such opinionated responses.
December 7, 2012 1:14 AM
QUOTE:

QUOTE:

...Don't you just love how people try to sound smart, when they have no clue what they are talking about?

Oh, the irony.
I'm sorry, did the big words confuse you, or do I need to provide references so you can fact check? Just curious, did you Graduate Cum Laude from College, and honors from HS?
December 7, 2012 1:17 AM
QUOTE:

Think about this logically: Adding tea (or any flavoring) to water does not change the water into anything else.

Many people choose not to count those things, but their bodies still recognize the water.

And LMAO at classifying tea as "garbage."


I second this; so dropping a tea bag into a cup of water turns it into what? That's right - water with a tea bag in it!
December 7, 2012 1:21 AM
QUOTE:

If your tea or coffee contains caffeine then you are shorting yourself on water. Coffee and tea are both diuretics which helps your body shed water. Caffeine also dehydrates you. Hydration is the whole point of drinking water. I still drink both coffee and tea daily I just don't count it as water intake. But, both are also good for you as they're both high antioxidants. You just have to watch what you add to them. smile


teas and coffees do act as diuretics but the volume of water that is in a cup of either more than compensates for the water lost so - no diuretic effect in total.
December 7, 2012 1:29 AM
Tea and Coffee are both duratics which by function, increase water excretion, so you're kind of sabotaging yourself.
December 7, 2012 1:33 AM
Just adding a tea bag to water, will of course not change the molecular structure of water, boiling the water while making tea will. The six catechin-derived polyphenols in tea leaves (C, EC, ECG, GC, EGC, and EGCG) are oxidized by the enzyme PPO (The firing of the leaves heats the enzymes to their peak activity rate). The catechins first form intermediate compounds called orthoquinones that are very unstable and reactive.The orthoquinones then combine in pairs in a series of condensation reactions. They can function as either hydrogen acceptors or hydrogen donors. The combinations can happen through C-O or C-C bonds. The compounds formed are called theaflavins (TF), which are larger molecules and are unique in chemistry. The catechins react in pairs to form six theaflavins. Some theaflavins are brighter and brisker than others showing that the quality of the tea depends not just on the polyphenol count, but the compostion of the catechins and the availability of PPO. The TFs are unstable and further oxidize through the action of PO. They then form thearubigins (TR). TRs are much larger and more complex. Their chemical structure is yet unknown . The compounds though, have a high complexation affinity with metals like Al and Mn, and alkaloids like caffeine. Thearubigins are largely responsible for the flavor, aroma, and color of the liqueur; some make it brighter and brisker, others dull.

Notice such words as "oxidation," "hydrogen acceptors," and "hydrogen donors." All indicate a chemical reaction between the tea and water. To simplify this, if it was a "physical" reaction, you could draw the tea out of the water by reverse osmosis like you could get the salt, sugar, or even lemon juice out of water.
December 7, 2012 1:51 AM
I log Tea and coffee as it is- now that's just logging on MFP diary, because it's there in the database so why not use it accurately right?
In terms of thinking that it doesn't count towards your "fluid" intake, well plain common sense tells me yeah it does.

Fluids are what they are and it's a lot of nonsense about tea and coffee and the notion of dehydration and that's it a diuretic...British people thrive on tea....in all my life here I have never seen anyone admitted to hospital as a result of drinking tea and nothing else and being brought in "suffering from dehydration".
If coffee and tea didn't count towards your fluid intake and was something else entirely-I would be ordering tea for my dinner in a restaurant- does that make sense to anyone?

Now if you’re buying your commercial coffee say from star bucks rather than making it yourself....well all (bar regular black coffee) have tons of calories, it quite literally is a "meal in a glass” with some special coffees topping over 700 calories!!! So, no I wouldn't log this as water.
Sometimes I think our bodies are cleverer than our brains that inhabit it.
Edited by Annawaywego On December 7, 2012 1:52 AM
December 7, 2012 1:58 AM
Yes, it counts as water. No, tea and coffee are not diuretics.
  26979358
December 7, 2012 2:01 AM
I went for long periods of my life where I probably drank a glass of water once a week, and I didn't die of dehydration! Mostly I was drinking Mtn dew. Obviously things other than plain water can hydrate you. That being said, the 8 cups of water 'goal' is so less scientific than calorie counting, log what you drink as what it is, drink enough for your body and stress about more important things ;)
December 7, 2012 2:08 AM
I don't drink water - I hate the stuff. Most of my fluid comes from very strong, black coffee which I drink a lot of (5-10 mugs per day). I drink Diet Coke too. Sometimes I'll have a herbal tea (~1-2 cups per week). My pee is the correct colour (very light straw colour), I get blood tests and urinalysis done every few months and have never been dehydrated.
December 7, 2012 2:20 AM
QUOTE:

Tea and Coffee are both duratics which by function, increase water excretion, so you're kind of sabotaging yourself.

Water is also a diuretic (it also increases water excretion). Therefore drinking water sabotages yourself.


noway
  1552106
December 7, 2012 2:27 AM
No...*eye twitch*
December 7, 2012 2:27 AM
I count fluid intake. I try to drink a lot of water but think tea is just as healthy. I do count coffee and other beverages as fluids but dont think it is as healthy.
  25982031
December 7, 2012 2:29 AM
QUOTE:

I don't see any reason why you couldn't add coffee and tea to your water intake, as long as you're logging the coffee and tea into your daily calories, and being sure to add any milk, sugars, creamer, etc. as well.


I couldnt have put this better myself......
December 7, 2012 2:36 AM
QUOTE:

Think about this logically: Adding tea (or any flavoring) to water does not change the water into anything else.

Many people choose not to count those things, but their bodies still recognize the water.

And LMAO at classifying tea as "garbage."



I agree totally. If nothing else is added to the tea... it's water. Just be careful with caffiene products, as
they dehydrate you.
December 7, 2012 2:39 AM
QUOTE:

Yes, it counts as water. No, tea and coffee are not diuretics.
[/
uote

YOu've lost 107 lbs, Im going with your advice. smile
December 7, 2012 2:47 AM
QUOTE:

I like to drink alot of water ( about 10 cups a day) but with the colder weather its getting harder to drink so much water. When you drink tea does it count as water intake???

I know where you're coming from there. I've just drank a bottle of water and I'm bloody freezing now, I always am when I drink water which is so annoying. But I've got to say, I won't class water as anything else, water is water.
December 7, 2012 4:17 AM
QUOTE:

QUOTE:

QUOTE:

If you want to get really technical, Chemistry wise, water can only equal water. Tea has over 2,000 chemical compounds in it. So, by adding tea to your water, you are changing the chemical make-up of the water thus making it no longer water but tea.

So, tea is NOT water.

Note: (added) MFP doesn't ask for "liquids", it asks for "Water".


But the water in which you brew the tea does not cease to be water when you add tea, on a molecular level. So, while the tea is not water, the water it's in is still water.
Lol, wrong again. Yes, I'm in college chemistry. It is actually a chemical reaction because it relies on the chemical properties of water and of the substances in the tea leaf. These substances-tannins, caffeine, and many others-dissolve in the hot water. The heat accelerates the reaction, but it is not a physical change. (Try steeping a tea bag in cold water-eventually you will get tea, although it will taste a bit different, probably because heat affects the dissolution of the various substances at different rates.) It's a chemical reaction therefore it does change the molecular properties of the water. Don't you just love how people try to sound smart, when they have no clue what they are talking about?


I weep for our future.
December 7, 2012 4:21 AM
QUOTE:

QUOTE:

Think about this logically: Adding tea (or any flavoring) to water does not change the water into anything else.

Many people choose not to count those things, but their bodies still recognize the water.

And LMAO at classifying tea as "garbage."
NOT TRUE AT ALL. Tea and coffee both contain caffeine which acts as a diuretic which in turn could actually cause dehydration, even caffeine free tea contains catechins which acts as a diuretic. Not only will it cause dehydration, but it also flushes out the vitamins and nutrients from your body caffeine depletes calcium from your bones, leading to osteoporosis. Only water is water.


Wow. I mean you are just SO SMART. You're so much smarter than those idiots at the Mayo Clinic, even!

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/caffeinated-drinks/AN01661

Researchers used to believe that caffeinated drinks had a diuretic effect. This means that you would urinate more after drinking them, which could increase your risk of becoming dehydrated. Recent research shows that this is not true and that caffeine has a diuretic effect only if you consume large amounts of it — more than 500 to 600 milligrams (the equivalent of 5 to 7 cups of coffee) a day.
December 7, 2012 4:22 AM
QUOTE:

QUOTE:

QUOTE:

QUOTE:

If you want to get really technical, Chemistry wise, water can only equal water. Tea has over 2,000 chemical compounds in it. So, by adding tea to your water, you are changing the chemical make-up of the water thus making it no longer water but tea.

So, tea is NOT water.

Note: (added) MFP doesn't ask for "liquids", it asks for "Water".


But the water in which you brew the tea does not cease to be water when you add tea, on a molecular level. So, while the tea is not water, the water it's in is still water.
Lol, wrong again. Yes, I'm in college chemistry. It is actually a chemical reaction because it relies on the chemical properties of water and of the substances in the tea leaf. These substances-tannins, caffeine, and many others-dissolve in the hot water. The heat accelerates the reaction, but it is not a physical change. (Try steeping a tea bag in cold water-eventually you will get tea, although it will taste a bit different, probably because heat affects the dissolution of the various substances at different rates.) It's a chemical reaction therefore it does change the molecular properties of the water. Don't you just love how people try to sound smart, when they have no clue what they are talking about?


I weep for our future.


laugh laugh laugh laugh
December 7, 2012 4:23 AM
No...
December 7, 2012 4:25 AM
I've just made another cup of tea.

Can one of you graduates above show me where structurally the components of tea connect with the molecule H2O please. I cannot see how anything in tea can structurally change water.
Edited by Yogi_Carl On December 7, 2012 4:27 AM
December 7, 2012 4:27 AM
IMO - tea/coffee DO NOT COUNT as water - if they have caffeine they act as a diuretic which dehydrates you. Decaf is fine to count as water.

water is water. just drink water, it's not that hard.
Edited by marycmeadows On December 7, 2012 4:28 AM
  9604811
December 7, 2012 4:28 AM
This thread is the reason I:

a) don't log my water at all.

b) stopped accepting friend requests.

I got tired of the endless little messages on my wall about either how much water they had consumed that day (just hit 188oz for today...52 to go!) or the stupid messages that I'm not drinking enough water, and my coffee doesn't count.

Yesterday I drank 2 large coffees, a glass of milk and a couple of glasses of water. Shockingly, I still woke up, alive and well, this morning. Now, where is my Starbucks card? I'm parched.
December 7, 2012 4:32 AM
According to my doctor, who is a very bright woman, as long as there is no aspartame, sugar, milk, etc in coffee or tea it is all water. Other research I have done indicates the diuretic effect of the caffeine in tea and coffee has little to no effect on the amount of water consumed. After forty years of insisting only water could be counted as water, even Weight Watchers with their nutritionists have determined the water in everything is water: even milk can be counted as consuming water, although the calories have to be counted as points. If you factor in the awesome antioxidants from tea (all of them) its like taking a multivitamin or herbal supplement with your water. Even coffee, which has taken hits from time to time from the scientific community, has been determined to be very safe and actually good for you. If you add cream, milk, or sugar, you'd need to log that as well.

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