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TOPIC: Lifting- How many calories burned?

 
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November 1, 2012 11:30 AM
QUOTE:

QUOTE:

Bahahahahahaha! Amazing!

QUOTE:

If someone startles you, your heart rate goes up too, even though you don't move. It might go as high as when you are sprinting.
Therefore, being startled burns the same calories as sprinting.

I'm going to go watch two scary movies at once and burn a thousand calories.


You can increase your heart rate simply by breathing faster sitting at a desk too... what drmerc is saying is that HR ALONE is not enough to indicate how many calories you are burning. *not trying to put words in your mouth. Even with a HR monitor you are still estimating how many calories you are burning by entering your numbers in an equation that is an estimate based on your age hight and CW. Its not 100%.


"Not trying to put words into your mouth"...if he meant it, he should state it rather than assume as most do.
And going back to the ORIGINAL Question....Combining Cardio WITH weights burns more than either Cardio OR Weights Alone.

Way to lose topic people.


Um....actually that was not the original question either....so way to lose topic yourself. the original question was how to calculate calories WHILE lifting. not what burns more lifting or cardio. Being an "Army Medic" hasnt helped with attention to detail i see.
Edited by SlimPossible8 On November 1, 2012 11:32 AM
  5834958
November 1, 2012 11:33 AM
QUOTE:

Um....actually that was not the origal question either....so way to lose topic yourself. the original question was how to calculate calories WHILE lifting. not what burns more lifting or cardio. Being an "Army Medic" hasnt helped with attention to detail i see.


Apparently, you didnt read all posts. But hey, whatever.
  27185297
November 1, 2012 11:33 AM
Strength training burns a lot of calories, more than jogging. If it doesn't do that for you, you are doing it wrong.

HRM's are pretty much as accurate at telling you your calorie burn as a dartboard.

Never mind that your heartrate isn't constant....the chemical reaction (anaerobic metabolism) that converts calories into mechancial force is far less efficient (18x less) at using calories than the chemical reaction that creates force for cardio (aerobic metabolsim). Look it up, this is basic biology. Due to there being no easily measured interaction that can measure calorie burn (as heartrate can for aerobic metabolism), it is near impossible to get a good estimate of calorie burn, you'd have to sample muscle tissue while the exercise is being performed. Needless to say this isn't done, even in labs (hence why there is virtually no research on this and noone really has any idea of how many calories strength training burns, everyone just copies everyone else, at the core of all this copying is a guess).

Using an automobile analogy.....HRM's measure gas useage by how far you go, and they assume you are driving a Prius down the interstate (doing steady state aerobic exercise). But when you strength train you are drag racing with a Hummer (doing high effort start-stop anaerobic exercise). Measuring gas useage by distance traveled, when you assume you are driving a Prius down the interstate, is ridiculosly inaccurate. That is essentially what you are doing when you use a HRM to measure calorie burn during strength training.

And this is ignoring the significant calorie cost of recovery. When you strength train you damage your muscles, a lot (especially if you work low hard reps). Recovering from this isn't free in calorie terms. Quite the opposite.

........

Needless to say, if you are doing high effort compounds (basically any real strength program), chances are there is no entry in the MFP database that captures your calorie burn. Everything is low. The high effort calisthenics and circuit training entries are at least in the ballpark, they even they are more of a safe estimate than an aggressive estimate.

There is a reason that people that try bulking almost always undershoot their calorie needs the first time, often by a laughable margin. People that are bulking don't eat 4000+ calories to watch the fat fly on, they eat that much because any less and they won't gain a thing. That right there is the calorie burn of strength training, that is generally grossly underestimated, that they have to overcome to gain.
Edited by waldo56 On November 1, 2012 11:43 AM
  12040936
November 1, 2012 11:36 AM
QUOTE:

QUOTE:

Um....actually that was not the origal question either....so way to lose topic yourself. the original question was how to calculate calories WHILE lifting. not what burns more lifting or cardio. Being an "Army Medic" hasnt helped with attention to detail i see.


Apparently, you didnt read all posts. But hey, whatever.


You said ORIGINAL question...Original meaning belonging or pertaining to the origin or beginning of something. so the original post was "Is there any surefire way to count the calories that you burn while lifting?"
  5834958
November 1, 2012 11:39 AM
QUOTE:

QUOTE:

QUOTE:

Really? Increasing your hear rate does not increase calorie burn? When your hear works harder, it's to remove toxic carbon dioxide from your muscles, so it's doing the same procedure for cardio as it is for weight training. I think you need to do some research because weight training done in the right way can burn just as many, if not more, calories as traditional cardiovascular activity. Sure, someone that waits 5 minutes between sets is not going to burn as many calories as somone on a treadmill but I can get my heartrate into the fat burning zone with weight training and keep it there pretty easily weight training.


Yes really
Calories are burned is determine by the number of muscle cells that are activated to preform your activity
THAT is what uses the energy and uses the oxygen

When weight training you are usually activating a small number of groups, such as your bicep when doing your brocurls

That causes a increase in heart rate to delivery oxygen to those cells, even though the rest of your body did not consume the energy, only a small amount of that oxygen would be consumed

Doing a series of strength training will cause your heart rate to bump up over and over but only consume a small amount of oxygen (which is what we are trying to measure to determine calorie burn)


YES REALLY

"The problem is a technical one. Calorie burning isn't determined by heart rate, it's determined by the number of muscle cells that are activated to perform a given activity. It's the working cells that actually use the energy (calories) and consume oxygen. When working muscle cells need more energy and oxygen, your heart rate goes up to deliver these things to the cells via the blood stream.

Any muscle that performs a high intensity or maximum effort (strength training) will trigger an increase in heart rate and blood flow. But if only a single muscle group is on the receiving end to utilize that extra oxygen (doing a strength exercise that isolates your biceps, for example), only a relatively small amount of oxygen (and calories) will actually be consumed.
"


Being that strength training primarily uses anaerobic metabolism, how much oxygen is used is irrelevant.

The chemical reactions that creates "the burn" for anaerobic-glycogen work, or the super high strength for low rep work, creatine-phosphate do not use oxygen as part of the reaction.

And those reactions are FAR less efficient at creating work from calories. They are gas guzzlers.
  12040936
November 1, 2012 11:39 AM
A couple of things I would like to throw into the pot:

1) when you perform a plank or side plank posture with your abs engaged and your butt tucked in, not just hanging there, your heart rate and breathing increases. No activity to speak of.

2) demand for calories drops off after cardio ends but with weight lifting, there is repair, there is muscle energy replacement, all the activity involved in muscle repair and growth and the fact that an increase in muscle mass demands more calories in itself - all of which inrease ongoing calorie demand overall.

I used to be suspicious about those who posted here saying weight lifting won over cardio when looking at reducing fat weight and burning calories, but I have stepped over the line it seems.
November 1, 2012 11:41 AM
QUOTE:

QUOTE:

Bahahahahahaha! Amazing!

QUOTE:

If someone startles you, your heart rate goes up too, even though you don't move. It might go as high as when you are sprinting.
Therefore, being startled burns the same calories as sprinting.

I'm going to go watch two scary movies at once and burn a thousand calories.


You can increase your heart rate simply by breathing faster sitting at a desk too... what drmerc is saying is that HR ALONE is not enough to indicate how many calories you are burning. *not trying to put words in your mouth. Even with a HR monitor you are still estimating how many calories you are burning by entering your numbers in an equation that is an estimate based on your age hight and CW. Its not 100%.


"Not trying to put words into your mouth"...if he meant it, he should state it rather than assume as most do.
And going back to the ORIGINAL Question....Combining Cardio WITH weights burns more than either Cardio OR Weights Alone.

Way to lose topic people.



This little diversion almost made me forget you were wrong earlier.


Almost.
  8625464
November 1, 2012 11:45 AM
Here is an answer for the OP: WomensHealthMag.com saying you can burn eight to 10 calories a minute by lifting weights. Anaerobic exercises can also bolster your metabolic rate and help you shed an extra 25 percent of the calories that have already burnt. "If you burned 200 calories lifting weights, it's really closer to 250 overall," said Westcott. This occurs because your body continues to work after completing a weightlifting session in an attempt to repair the muscle fibers that were damaged during training.

http://www.livestrong.com/article/418902-calories-burned-muscle-mass-gained-during-weight-lifting-exercises/#ixzz2Azw9jWg7
  30831459
November 1, 2012 11:46 AM
.
Edited by iplayoutside19 On November 1, 2012 11:48 AM
November 1, 2012 11:47 AM
QUOTE:

QUOTE:

QUOTE:


Please, post where you know this knowledge. Mine comes from being trained by the US Army as Medic, of which, part of my duties were to oversee the BOLO's



Ask for a refund?


Seriously? You just lost all my respect. Normally, you are good with information. Insulting because you back your point, tasteless. I hope you never in need of military support....


i agree! he doesnt deserve respect based on the attitude ive seen just in this one forum. there is a nicer way to give you opinion.
Edited by cbrrabbit25 On November 1, 2012 11:50 AM
  29018481
November 1, 2012 11:49 AM
There is a strength training option under the cardiovascular exercises. I use that. Although, I feel the burn is less than I actually burn. I always do compound, high rep, low weight 8-10lbs when I strength train.
November 1, 2012 11:50 AM
Has anybody that says strength training doesn't burn many calories....

Actually tried and been successful at bulking whilst controlling calorie intake (thus would need to know how many calories strengthttraining burns)?

You will find very few people that have been successful at bulking that believe that strength training doesn't burn a lot of calories.
Edited by waldo56 On November 1, 2012 11:52 AM
  12040936
November 1, 2012 11:55 AM
QUOTE:

If someone startles you, your heart rate goes up too, even though you don't move. It might go as high as when you are sprinting.
Therefore, being startled burns the same calories as sprinting.

I'm going to go watch two scary movies at once and burn a thousand calories.


I just heard that on the radio the other day. Someone did a study and said you burn more calories when watching a scary movie, because it elevates you're heart rate. laugh
  19648884
November 1, 2012 11:56 AM
Most calorie burn in weight training comes from recovery, which cannot be estimated by a HRM. I have seen estimates ranging from 4-9 calories per calorie your HRM will show over 72 hours in terms of recovery costs for high-intensity workouts (i.e. training to total failure). Simply put, there is no solid science around this yet, so take that as you will. You DEFINITELY burn WAY more calories/hour doing weights than steady-state cardio (unless maybe you are maintaining a 90+% HR max level during your cardio workouts). Theoretically you could probably burn about the same doing HIIT, as anaerobic expenditures have large recovery costs, and the cardio burn would be a lot higher, which should make up for the reduced cost of muscle repair.

Overall, weight training is more efficient in terms of preservation of LBM, while huge cardio calorie burns result in loss of LBM (which is why marathon runners/endurance athletes calibrate their caloric intake over the course of an event to maintain body weight and/or eat huge pre-post training meals... some of my friends do 10k+ cals in a day, which is just nuts).
November 1, 2012 12:01 PM
QUOTE:

Is there any surefire way to count the calories that you burn while lifting?

Every day, I try to do 30 minutes of cardio and then I move onto the weights, working a different muscle group each day. I started doing this about two months ago but I never know how to track the exercises on myfitnesspal.

Anyone else have any advice or are you wondering the same thing?

Please and thank you!


I'm doing NROL4W. I've worn my HRM a few times, even though I know they aren't as accurate on strength training. Anyway, my HRM reads almost exactly what MFP says for strength training (under cardio exercises). For me it's about 100 calories for a half hour.
  19648884
November 1, 2012 12:03 PM
QUOTE:

QUOTE:

Is there any surefire way to count the calories that you burn while lifting?

Every day, I try to do 30 minutes of cardio and then I move onto the weights, working a different muscle group each day. I started doing this about two months ago but I never know how to track the exercises on myfitnesspal.

Anyone else have any advice or are you wondering the same thing?

Please and thank you!


I'm doing NROL4W. I've worn my HRM a few times, even though I know they aren't as accurate on strength training. Anyway, my HRM reads almost exactly what MFP says for strength training (under cardio exercises). For me it's about 100 calories for a half hour.


interesting. MFP puts me at about 350/hr I think.
My HRM put me at something crazy like 1400... (polar ft7) for a little more than an hour.
Edited by wellbert On November 1, 2012 12:03 PM
November 1, 2012 12:08 PM
QUOTE:

QUOTE:

QUOTE:

Is there any surefire way to count the calories that you burn while lifting?

Every day, I try to do 30 minutes of cardio and then I move onto the weights, working a different muscle group each day. I started doing this about two months ago but I never know how to track the exercises on myfitnesspal.

Anyone else have any advice or are you wondering the same thing?

Please and thank you!


I'm doing NROL4W. I've worn my HRM a few times, even though I know they aren't as accurate on strength training. Anyway, my HRM reads almost exactly what MFP says for strength training (under cardio exercises). For me it's about 100 calories for a half hour.


interesting. MFP puts me at about 350/hr I think.
My HRM put me at something crazy like 1400... (polar ft7) for a little more than an hour.


I have been wearing mine for strength training too. It tells me about 350-400 depending on the warm up I do.
November 1, 2012 12:09 PM
QUOTE:

QUOTE:

QUOTE:

QUOTE:

Is there any surefire way to count the calories that you burn while lifting?

Every day, I try to do 30 minutes of cardio and then I move onto the weights, working a different muscle group each day. I started doing this about two months ago but I never know how to track the exercises on myfitnesspal.

Anyone else have any advice or are you wondering the same thing?

Please and thank you!


I'm doing NROL4W. I've worn my HRM a few times, even though I know they aren't as accurate on strength training. Anyway, my HRM reads almost exactly what MFP says for strength training (under cardio exercises). For me it's about 100 calories for a half hour.


interesting. MFP puts me at about 350/hr I think.
My HRM put me at something crazy like 1400... (polar ft7) for a little more than an hour.


I have been wearing mine for strength training too. It tells me about 350-400 depending on the warm up I do.


I'm pretty sure my heavy use of the valsalva maneuver has a lot to do with the reading being so high.
November 1, 2012 12:11 PM
As others have said, it's very difficult to measure calories burned during weightlifting for a number of reasons.

1. you are stopping and starting frequently
2. We have no idea of your current body composition, the exercises you are doing, weight involved, etc.

I might also suggest that instead of doing a split routine switch to a full body routine three days a week. These tend to include more multi-joint exercises (deadlift, squats, rows, presses) and burn much more energy than doing only barbell curls, etc.

I do the routine linked below and have had good success with it. Each workout really incorporates your whole body and surprisingly my abs and trunk are usually my sorest regions the next day.

http://www.muscleandstrength.com/articles/forget-steroids-5-fullbody-workouts-for-serious-gains.html#2
November 1, 2012 12:22 PM
And in response to a comment that was made (but then edited/deleted), the typical definition of "work" doesn't, well, work for determining calories burned. We're interested in energy expended, not work. Think of someone pushing against an immovable wall. If the wall doesn't move, then no work was accomplished, but that doesn't mean energy wasn't expended. In other words, plyometrics still burn calories.
  8625464
November 1, 2012 12:26 PM
What if you do 2 mins of cardio (like jumping jacks) in between each set? Would that be considered circuit training in the mfp exercise database? I know I'm jumping into a sh*t show thread here, I'm trying to learn about strength training and legitimately curious.
  29504945
November 1, 2012 12:41 PM
bump
November 1, 2012 12:41 PM
QUOTE:

What if you do 2 mins of cardio (like jumping jacks) in between each set? Would that be considered circuit training in the mfp exercise database? I know I'm jumping into a sh*t show thread here, I'm trying to learn about strength training and legitimately curious.



I think you're missing the overall big picture and confusing the goal (which happens a lot here). Don't change what you're doing to fit the measurement. Just understand that an "accurate" measure of calories burned from strength training is not possible (or at least not practical). The important thing is to choose some estimated amount of burn per minute, use it consistently over time (while also consistently logging food), and then weeks/months from now, make adjustments as necessary to your calories in/calories burned depending on how quickly you are/are not progressing towards your goal. Ultimately, it isn't the number on a website that dictates your success or lack thereof...it's the actual results. Don't fall into the trap of manipulating the measurement at the expense of actual results.
  8625464
November 1, 2012 12:42 PM
QUOTE:

QUOTE:

I don't know how intense everyone's weight lifting sessions are, or how heavy they're lifting...but the general consensus seems to be that you don't burn many calories weight lifting. In my personal experience, my heart rate gets as high if not higher during a lifting session than a cardio session...and I typically have a sopping wet shirt to prove it. I don't use an HRM or even log weight lifting in MFP but I feel like lifting can potentially burn a lot more calories than people think, depending on the intensity of the lifting session.


Heart rate and sweat are not a indication of number of calories burned


True, good point.
November 1, 2012 12:51 PM
QUOTE:

QUOTE:

QUOTE:

QUOTE:

QUOTE:

Is there any surefire way to count the calories that you burn while lifting?

Every day, I try to do 30 minutes of cardio and then I move onto the weights, working a different muscle group each day. I started doing this about two months ago but I never know how to track the exercises on myfitnesspal.

Anyone else have any advice or are you wondering the same thing?

Please and thank you!


I'm doing NROL4W. I've worn my HRM a few times, even though I know they aren't as accurate on strength training. Anyway, my HRM reads almost exactly what MFP says for strength training (under cardio exercises). For me it's about 100 calories for a half hour.


interesting. MFP puts me at about 350/hr I think.
My HRM put me at something crazy like 1400... (polar ft7) for a little more than an hour.


I have been wearing mine for strength training too. It tells me about 350-400 depending on the warm up I do.


I'm pretty sure my heavy use of the valsalva maneuver has a lot to do with the reading being so high.


Hmmm, interesting. I use TDEE for the calories I eat everyday instead of MFP + exercise calories. I just keep track of calorie burn, because I'm a hopeless number cruncher. I have spreadsheets for everything lol. The interesting thing is, as I've increased weight, the calorie burn has stayed pretty much the same.
  19648884

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