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TOPIC: 30-day shred.... Where's the rest???

 
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November 29, 2010 8:22 PM
I've started doing the 30-day shred and the way I understand it, we are supposed to do it 30 days in a row. Well, most of the excercises are strength work. Aren't you supposed to rest after doing strength work? I'm sore and have been since I started doing it. I've taken a day off (two actually since starting) but I feel like I'm doing it "wrong" with those breaks and that I'm supposed to keep doing it. But I know my muscles need to repair - is that supposed to happen after day 30? I should mention that I'm adding the shred to my regular workouts because I'm pretty sure that it can't really replace my hour workouts. I'm mostly doing it for the strength work and also because it just gets me 20 more minutes of activity every day. So should I take a break?
  2763356
November 29, 2010 8:33 PM
I talked to my doctor about this very issue a couple weeks ago and she said not to feel guilty about taking breaks. Listen to your body; if it's telling you that it needs a rest day, take a rest day. I struggle with letting myself rest, but it's an important part of fitness that shouldn't be ignored.

I did my first round of it 29 days straight--then HAD to take a rest day due to stomach flu--and am currently back to Level 3 on a second round of the Shred, not to mention mixing it up with some of her other workouts. If you're looking for more of a cardio workout, I highly recommend Jillian Michaels' Banish Fat, Boost Metabolism for an intense cardio session. It's about 42 minutes of cardio bookended by 5 minute stretching sessions. :)
  1211418
November 29, 2010 8:35 PM
I have the 30 day shred and from what I have gathered with it's combination of cardio and strength ...though it doesn't seem as intensive if you are doing the level 2 and 3 it could be a viable work out that is challenging and can be done everyday.

If you are in a lot of pain might rotate which level you are doing each day. If you are worried about muscle repair might look into protein shakes or bars after work outs. but taking like a day to rest isn't bad either. Especially if you feel your muscles are getting that hard of a work out. Nothing wrong with it so don't beat yourself up about it.
November 29, 2010 8:36 PM
I have this same problem! I do the 30 day shred in addition to other workouts. I am curious to see what everyone else says about breaks.. thanks for posting this!
November 29, 2010 8:37 PM
Tonya,

If you're sore, you might want to check your form in the mirror just to be sure that's not any part of your soreness. If not, then sore is okay but do watch for any signs of strain. Drink your water and eat your potassium. Both with help - along with the hot baths and warm ups in the morning (you won't believe how much that will help!). 30 Day is intended to be a daily workout for 30 days and it incorporates cardio and strength. That's also why it's only 30 minutes of work out and offers alternate positions - so you don't over-tax your system. However, I do think Jillian makes a small error in not addressing those that have other daily workouts that they also use and when a break may or may not be needed based on those routines.

Some things I've found is that you can modify the 30 day workouts to make them easier or harder so that it's a system you can actually extend 90+ days for each level. It's a very flexible set of routines and can also be easily broken up to be incoporated at various stages in other routines. So, just do what seems best for you and if part of that means taking a day or two off to allow for rest, then do so.

Good luck & congratulations on your successes!!
  665391
November 29, 2010 8:52 PM
Your muscles absolutely need a break. If you're working out bigger muscle groups, like you back, chest, biceps etc... they usually need atleast two days, three would be good. If your really sore, especially from starting a new workout routine, you want to make sure that you're getting your protein post workout along with L-glutamine! L-glutamine is an amino acid that is the most common in your muscles and your muscles need it to repair themselves. I always use www.bodybuilding.com to get my l-glutamine and whey protein powder. Another think you can do to help with being sore and muscle repair is to keep your body in an anabolic state. This means that your body will be repairing and building muscle, as opposed to being catabolic, breaking down muscle!! So, to do this, you should be eating a complete protein (meat, chicken, eggs, whey protein) every three or four hours. Before you go to sleep, if you're still sore after all that, you could eat some casein protein powder, which is a slow digesting protein, so when you are sleeping, you'll stay anabolic longer!!

Good luck, I hope this helps!
November 30, 2010 6:52 PM
QUOTE:

Your muscles absolutely need a break. If you're working out bigger muscle groups, like you back, chest, biceps etc... they usually need atleast two days, three would be good. If your really sore, especially from starting a new workout routine, you want to make sure that you're getting your protein post workout along with L-glutamine! L-glutamine is an amino acid that is the most common in your muscles and your muscles need it to repair themselves. I always use www.bodybuilding.com to get my l-glutamine and whey protein powder. Another think you can do to help with being sore and muscle repair is to keep your body in an anabolic state. This means that your body will be repairing and building muscle, as opposed to being catabolic, breaking down muscle!! So, to do this, you should be eating a complete protein (meat, chicken, eggs, whey protein) every three or four hours. Before you go to sleep, if you're still sore after all that, you could eat some casein protein powder, which is a slow digesting protein, so when you are sleeping, you'll stay anabolic longer!!

Good luck, I hope this helps!


I've just found time to reply to this now, but I have a question (and thanks everyone for your replies!). I looked at some protein bars and drinks at walmart today and they all have a TON of calories (well, it seemed like a lot to me). except this one drink that came in a big vial type thing. Do I need to get things like that to help get more protein or will regular foods help. After most of my am workouts, I have either a bagel (I know, not the best choice) with peanut butter or whole wheat toast with peanut butter. Then I usually have some type of protein with my other means (lunch and dinner), like lunch is often a turkey burger or a ham sandwich, etc.

My muscles feel like they are taking a long time to heal right now, and I would really like to help them along - I just don't really know how. The tip about having a complete protein every three or four hours is one I'll try to work on! What is a complete protein, by the way?

Then I wonder if all those protein drinks or bars even taste good. They look disgusting. I've never been able to choke down thick drinks - I don't even drink milk - or smoothies that other people love... The one in a vial looked a bit like gatorade and it was fruit punch flavored. I almost bought it to try it, but I feel like I'm taking a drug or something bad LOL!

What is L-glutamine? what is casein protein powder?

And someone else mentioned potasium - I have no idea what that does either (I'm sure I'm supposed to, but I don't keep up on those things very well).

I know at this point you probably aren't checking this post anymore (I wish mfp alerted you when someone replied to you), so I'm going to go do some searching for more info!!
  2763356
November 30, 2010 7:28 PM
Potassium:

Many times (but not always) if you're getting sore, it's a potassium shortage - much of which gets burned during heavy workouts. It's a micronutrient / electrolyte.

"It helps keep the water (the amount of fluid inside and outside the body's cells) and electrolyte balance of the body. Potassium is also important in how nerves and muscles work."

For more information:


http://www.webmd.com/a-to-z-guides/potassium-k-in-blood

Hope this helps! :-)
  665391
December 1, 2010 5:24 AM
Oh, interesting. I read that article and it said "When sodium levels go up, potassium levels go down, and when sodium levels go down, potassium levels go up" I know I had lots of sodium over thanksgiving - much more than normal. Maybe that explains why I've been so extra sore the last week and the soreness is just hanging in there (well, and I know I've been adding some strength work and a few new things). Plus, sometimes I drink a gadorade during a workout which is loaded with sodium. I guess that's a bad thing to do.

Thanks for the tip!
  2763356
December 1, 2010 5:54 AM
Since you mentioned that you had a lot of sodium that week... Keep in mind that having a lot of sodium can cause you to retain water, which could be one reason why the scale hasn't moved much.

And as far as protein shakes go: I personally love the Myoplex Lite (11 oz size). It comes in a couple flavors, but I like the chocolate fudge, and since it's the light version it's very low fat and not too many calories. It's got 20 g of protein and tons of other vitamins, and I usually chug one after a hard workout if I know I won't be able to eat a meal within half an hour like you're supposed to. You can get them really cheap in bulk at Sam's Club! I haven't really tried any other protein shakes, so I don't know how they compare.
  2371548
December 1, 2010 7:59 AM
QUOTE:

Since you mentioned that you had a lot of sodium that week... Keep in mind that having a lot of sodium can cause you to retain water, which could be one reason why the scale hasn't moved much.

And as far as protein shakes go: I personally love the Myoplex Lite (11 oz size). It comes in a couple flavors, but I like the chocolate fudge, and since it's the light version it's very low fat and not too many calories. It's got 20 g of protein and tons of other vitamins, and I usually chug one after a hard workout if I know I won't be able to eat a meal within half an hour like you're supposed to. You can get them really cheap in bulk at Sam's Club! I haven't really tried any other protein shakes, so I don't know how they compare.


Is it pre-mixed? I'm going to check that out - thanks!!!!!

I hope it's water retention that's keeping me up on the scale. I'm so mad because on Nov 20, I saw 155.0 on the scale before going out for a few drinks (and that was at night). Then with thanksgiving a few days later, and then the messed up schedule and eating from black Friday, the scale is not being nice to me. It's now still at 156.8 today... I was so excited to see 155 and now I'm wondering if it wasn't just a fluke. Oh well - I will get there soon! On the plus side, my workout clothes are falling off me LOL!! Yesterday in my aerobic class, I kept having to pull up my pants after burpies - I guess it's time to get new ones!!
  2763356
December 1, 2010 8:13 AM
I did the 30 day shred in 30 days (and I'm in my 60s).
Remember--for the entire dvd its only 9 min of strength, none that involves lifting heavy weights, then 5 min of cardio--which you can modify and 3 min of abs, divided up into 3 --3min, 2 min, 1 min sessions.
I could do all of level one by day 5--at first for the jump ropes I had to do a little jog instead. I never did risk my joints with the Jump squats or plank jacks in levels 2 and 3, but did other cardio that my HRM said raised my HR (the modifications on the DVD didn't get my HR up for cardio)
The important thing is to recognize your limits and not try to be a superstar. If it hurts, modify to something easier. I looked at it this way--Its 18 min out of my day. If I can't find 18 min to move around then there is something wrong with me.
  143739
December 1, 2010 9:20 AM
I've seen that a lot of people on MFP rest every other day from the 30DS. I'm on day 22 but have only had 2 days off (when I felt I really needed them). Everyone is different so if you feel like you should be resting, then do. :)
December 1, 2010 9:51 AM
QUOTE:

I've started doing the 30-day shred and the way I understand it, we are supposed to do it 30 days in a row. Well, most of the excercises are strength work. Aren't you supposed to rest after doing strength work? I'm sore and have been since I started doing it. I've taken a day off (two actually since starting) but I feel like I'm doing it "wrong" with those breaks and that I'm supposed to keep doing it. But I know my muscles need to repair - is that supposed to happen after day 30? I should mention that I'm adding the shred to my regular workouts because I'm pretty sure that it can't really replace my hour workouts. I'm mostly doing it for the strength work and also because it just gets me 20 more minutes of activity every day. So should I take a break?


Yes you are supposed to rest in between weights for the same muscle group. This video set up shows Jillian's lack of education in proper exercise prescription.
Edited by TrainingWithTonya On December 1, 2010 9:55 AM
December 1, 2010 11:17 AM
QUOTE:

I did the 30 day shred in 30 days (and I'm in my 60s).
Remember--for the entire dvd its only 9 min of strength, none that involves lifting heavy weights, then 5 min of cardio--which you can modify and 3 min of abs, divided up into 3 --3min, 2 min, 1 min sessions.
I could do all of level one by day 5--at first for the jump ropes I had to do a little jog instead. I never did risk my joints with the Jump squats or plank jacks in levels 2 and 3, but did other cardio that my HRM said raised my HR (the modifications on the DVD didn't get my HR up for cardio)
The important thing is to recognize your limits and not try to be a superstar. If it hurts, modify to something easier. I looked at it this way--Its 18 min out of my day. If I can't find 18 min to move around then there is something wrong with me.


I'm not saying I can't do it. I'm definetly not saying 18 minutes is too much for me. However if my muscles are sore (I'm not just talking tired, I'm talking sore and at moments painful if I try to work them again), I DO think 18 minutes of the same thing is perhaps not good for them. On day 1, I did all of level one - no breaks and in fact, I get in extra moves while they stand still transitioning to the next cardio or strenght move (while she says - no stopping now LOL). I do the moves fully and correctly and I'm not hurting myself (my joints). What does get sore is my muscles afterwards because I'm working them!! The next day, I did it again even though I was sore. But then I was till sore the next day. What I'm wondering is, where is the rest? Her plan sounds like it's supposed to be 30 days of this continuously, and I'm wondering how you build muscles when you don't give them rest to repair themselves. Either that, or you don't work so hard that they hurt - in which case, how are you building muscles,and therefore, what's the point? See what I mean? She's asking us to do the exact same thing day after day. I don't see how that lets your muscles repair themselves.

I am in pretty good physical condition cardo-wise at this point (I think, anyway). I am able to maintain a very high intensity for 60 mins on the elliptical (78-85 RPM, 7 miles), and then 2 hours later jump into a high impact cardio class for 45 minutes making every single move count (watching other people simply doing the moves - there is a big difference). I'm able to fully complete advanced high-impact step aerobic dvd that I've had stashed away for years for the full 30 minutes and then stick in 2 more dvds for another 40 minutes!! My aerobic classes and videos do include some strength work (about the same as the shred tape when you add it all together), but they are working muscles differently than this one, and my muscles aren't used to it and they are sore. Every time I do something new, I get sore. Perhaps because I try to make the most of every move. Perhaps I'm trying to be a super star, but I guess I am one of those people who feels they need to work as hard as they can to get the most benefit out of every move, but I enjoy it and it feels great. I'm just wondering how this 30 day shred is supposed to build me up when it feels like it's just breaking me down without giving me a chance to repair.

Are there really people who don't get sore from this or need to give their muscles rest? I know it's not a lot of time and heavy lifting, but that doesn't mean you can't work hard enough to make changes in your body. Isn't that the whole point? And doesn't your body still need time to re-build after you break them down? Even if it isn't at a body-building level? Jillian says she expects us to work hard every second of the workout, and if you honestly do that, it seems like you should be working hard enough to really break down those muscles. Well, how do they get stronger if you don't let them rest?

PS - GREAT job on finishing it in 30 days!
Edited by TonyaGonya On December 1, 2010 11:28 AM
  2763356
December 1, 2010 12:19 PM
I was just pointing out that you can modify--think of it as an active rest day. After day 2 of level 2, I was sore--like you said, really sore ( I was using too heavy weights). For the next three days or so (until I wasn't sore at all) I just didn't use weights. I knew I was overdoing it when I couldn't lift the saddle onto my horse.
So that's how I managed, knowing exactly what is right for my body. I will say that for the first time I can do real push-ups, so I feel the routine worked for me. Since the nearest gym is about 45 min away I do my activities mainly outside and as such other than barn work tend to ingore strength exercises. This motivated me.
For people who do alot of other workouts--I can see that doing the Shred everyday is probably not the best route.The 18 min remark wasn't directed at you--I hear from people in my age group (60s) that they don't have time to workout--it's too hard--it's too dangerous--etc etc. Last night I had a friend come over while I was exercising and I said--just give me 10 more min. They sort of made fun of me and I thought--you spend more than 18 min on your hair, cut me a break. So sorry if you took it the wrong way.
  143739
December 1, 2010 1:38 PM
Well, I know I can modify, but that's kind of my point. If she's giving us such a hard core plan for 30 days to shred up to 20 pounds, shouldn't she give us something that builds rest time in? Like give us 6 videos instead of 3 then. Level 1 would have 2 videos that you alternate between and they work different muscles on alternate days so each muscle has a day to rest. That would make more sense to me. So she kicks our butt 30 days in a row for real!! No rest!! But that's not what I'm getting out of it, and I guess I'm just disapointed - either in her or myself.

I don't know - maybe I'm just in a complaining mood, but I guess I expected better from her. It's the first video I've tried from her and I guess I'm just not thrilled about it. Plus, I'm frustrated that I can't just keep doing it day after day. I'm not someone who likes to quit - I want to complete the 30 days in a row like I hear so many other people are doing - but I know it's not healthy for me to do that. I honestly don't understand how others can do it if they are getting sore like me. And if they aren't getting sore, are they really doing it 100%? Maybe so, but then what am I doing wrong that I am not able to do it? I know I need to rest, and honestly even if I do it without weights, it's still working my sore muscles. For example, If I just stand up and try to do those lunging squat things even without weights in my hands, I have pain in my leg muscles that tells me to give it a rest! You know how she has the two girls back there? Well, when I do my lunges, squats or butt kicks or whatever, I'm doing them in the 'advanced' mode or whatever she calls it. I don't feel like I'm doing myself any good if I'm not giving it everything I've got and I have the physical ability to do it all the way, so I feel like that's what I need to do to get the most out of it. Maybe I need to learn to relax and not work so dang hard every time... I don't know - I'm frustrated :-) I think I do this to myself though - I push too hard and expect too much from myself probably. A very bad habit of mine, and it gets me into trouble (in other words - burnout).

I think I'm going to give it a rest until I feel pretty close to healed up, and then I'll start over. Maybe if my mucles are more used to it, I'll be able to go straight through 30 days. Or maybe I'll just continue counting days and allow myself the rest days I need. I drive myself crazy!!
  2763356
December 1, 2010 2:00 PM
I get exactly what you are saying. I do outside walking or wogging hikes with hills, ride my horse and bike. then I have a bunch of different dvds. One thing I did not like about the shred for 30 days straight is that 10 days doing the same thing didn't seem right. Unlike you there are some of the plyo moves I just cannot do--it would be a dumb for me to try so I did something else that my HRM said got my HR up. BUT--I was stubborn and figured I started it and dang it I would finish in 30 days.
Now that I am back to my routine of supplementing my outside workouts with my varied DVDs I did level 1 today, it seemed like a good once in a while session, and I'll do the same with all three levels.
I don't think anyone loses alot of weight with the Shred (back to the get real--it's 18 min long bit). But it can maybe jump start someone into strength training.
I do get worried when I read about people saying they need knee braces because of the Shred, or get injured. Again--might be my age, but I keep thinking--hey--this is your one and only body, take care of it so that when you are old and gray you can still do stuff.
I agree with you that it doesn't live up to the hype, and since you already are very fit and do alot I can feel your frustration with the hype and the concept. Why don't you just include the dvd in your library of workouts...switch up the levels depending on what you want to work on any given day.

I'm impressed with what you can do (well--I'm jealous) and keep it up--but most of all HAVE FUN!!!
  143739
December 2, 2010 3:13 AM
First thing. If you're trying to build muscle you can't do that on a deficit you may have some newbie gains but you will not build muscle while on a calorie deficit. Second of all Tonya is right Jillian Michaels is way off. Rest is very important, 1-2 days a week at least. I have looked at 30 day shred and if I'm interested in building muscle or improving my cardiovascular endurance I can think of several better ways. And you're right muscles need time to rest. You can get a better workout working out 3-4 days a week with better improvements than working out for 30 days with her shred videos. Even P90x has a rest day and always alternates days so you're not working the same muscles two days in a row. P90x is much more advanced though obviously, so don't undertake it without consent from your doctor. If your body needs rest. Take it. It's that simple.
Edited by BoresEasily On December 2, 2010 3:14 AM
December 2, 2010 4:51 AM
QUOTE:

First thing. If you're trying to build muscle you can't do that on a deficit you may have some newbie gains but you will not build muscle while on a calorie deficit. ......


Seriously????? UGH!! I have never heard this before! Even if you're not trying to bulk up - just tone and strengthen and make them look nice and strong? So how does one lose weight and gain muscle tone at the same time?
  2763356
December 2, 2010 7:02 AM
I know lots of people do the 30 day shred every day, but I don't really think you should. Unless you are using weights that are too light to make a difference anyway. I would alternate one day of shred with a day of cardio. Just my opinion.

When you are strength training you should not be working the same muscles two days in a row. You need to give your muscles time to repair themselves.
December 2, 2010 12:38 PM
QUOTE:

QUOTE:

First thing. If you're trying to build muscle you can't do that on a deficit you may have some newbie gains but you will not build muscle while on a calorie deficit. ......


Seriously????? UGH!! I have never heard this before! Even if you're not trying to bulk up - just tone and strengthen and make them look nice and strong? So how does one lose weight and gain muscle tone at the same time?


Yes, you can build muscle while in calorie deficit. But you have to have exactly the right amount of macros to do it. Basically, you have to have extra protein (about 25-50 grams per day) and not cut carbs. If you cut carbs, you can't do it because the protein that would be used to build muscle is being used to produce the glycogen needed to fuel workouts and start the fat burning process. But, if you have enough carbs and protein, then the carbs will be there to burn for workouts and help the body get into fat burning while the protein is devoted to building muscle.
December 2, 2010 5:40 PM
Well, that's good to know! I'll check how I'm doing with carbs and protein and make sure I'm getting enough of everything. Thanks for the info!!!
  2763356

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